Rising Sun Times, Volume 4, Number 167, Rising Sun, Ohio County, 28 January 1837 — Page 1

THE

RISING

TIMES

"i WISH NO OTHER HERALD, NO OTHER SPEAKER OF MY LIVING ACTIONS, TO KEEP KIXE HONOR FROM CORRlj PTlON."

BY AfiEX. E.

Division of Dearborn county. From the Indiana Journal. IN SENATE, JAN. 9. Mr. Thompson of L., from the judiciary committee, to which was referred the engrossed hill of the House of Representatives entitled "a bill to form a new county out of the county of Dearborn." reported the bill back to the Senate with an amendment, the substance of which is, that if, on a survey of the county of Dearborn, it shall appear that there is no surplus territory, then the county of Ohio shall not be considered as organized, and providing also that the petitioners shall pay all the expenses of a survey; which amendment, after being amended on motion of Mr. Dumont, was concurred in. Mr. Smith moved that the further consideration of the bill be indefinitely postponed. Mr. Plummer moved a call of the Senate, which was agreed to. After the absent members came in, Mr. Plummer said he felt called upon to make a few remarks. lie could not consent to the passage of the bill notwithstanding the amendments that had been made. lie had doubts of the constitutionality of the measure even with the amendment made by the judiciary Committee. lie deemed it improper to legislate at all about the division of the county, without a knowledge that there is a surplus of territory. All the evidence in his possession satisfied him that there was a deficiency, instead of a surplus. The late and present surveyor general both testify to that fact. But even if it were constitutional, he should be opposed to the bill on grounds of policy and expediency. lie could not think it proper to make a county out of seventeen sections of land. He said there was no petition from the people for this bill. The pe titions were for all the county south of L.aughery creek. Tne bill is not m accordance with the petitions. It is made thus -email at present to avoid the constitutional objection, and it is intended, hereafter, to add to the bill, fie hoped the Senate would not lay a foundation for such difficulties as the passage of this bill would produce. Mr. Liston gave his views in favor of postponement. He felt opposed to the bill at first, and the arguments pro and con, to which he had attentively listened, had not changed his mind. The passage of the bill would, in the apt language of the gentleman from Delaware, be treading close upon the heels of the constitution. But, independently of the constitutional objection to the bill, he thought it improper to pass it, on account of the srnallness of the territory. The passage of the bill would be but an entering wedge for further and more enlarged difficulties. It could net be expected that the people of thai small territory would bear the expenses of a county seat. I asthis bill, said he, and petition after petition would be forwarded for further additions. He believed that the passage of this bill would increase, instead of allaying the excitement and conten tion which have prevailed in Dearborn countv for sometime past. He would therefore vote for the motion. Mr. Kennedy avowed a change of opinion on the subject since this bill was first introduced. lie had become satisfied that the bill as amended, was not in violation of the constitution. He had attended the meeting of the judici ary committee and heard witnesses ex amined, under oath, as to the effect oi the measure, and had become satisfied ifrom the evidence, that nothing short ,of a division of the county would settle .the difficulties in that county which have existed for twenty years. He would vote against the postponement, .and in favor of the bill. Mr. Smith spoke in favor of the mo tion. There was no people, he said, for whom he had more respect, than the people of Rising Sun, for whose ac commodation in part this measure was intended, and he had great respect for the members from Dearborn county in the other branch of the legislature; but he was compelled, from a serine of duty, to oppose their wishes on the present occasion. He gave a brief sketch of the rise and progress of the difficulties which had existed in Dear born county for some years past, and atn his oninion as to the motives which had caused the introduction of the bill The petioners are from the upper and lowpr ends of the county from the

vicinity of Lawrenceburgh and the vi

RISlXtt JLADIAAA, SATURDAY, .lUl.lRV S8, t$37.

cinity of Rising Sun: and the passage of this bill is expected to secure to eac'. of those places a countv seat. The leading object of one portion of the petitioners is undoubtedly to remove the present county seat from Wilmington to Lawrenceburgh. It had been urged as a strong reason for the passage of the bill that it would settle the local difficulties and excitements in the county. He differed with gentlemen in opinion on this subject, and believed that instead of settling, it would widen and extend them. The difficulties were now confined to Dearborn county, but pass this bill and you involve the surrounding counties in the same difficultics. Mr. Vawter gave a history of the difficulties to which Dearborn county had been subjected in regard to the county seat. He stated that at the time Ripley county was formed, every foot was taken from Dearborn county that she had to spare. He considered tbal the passage of the bill was clearly unconstitutional: and even if it were not unconstitutional, he could not deem it expedient. He dwelt at large upon the dangerous consequences of throwing open the door for petitions for new counties, which, if this bill pass, will crowd your table as much as do the petitions for internal improvements. Mr. Collins spoke in favor of the bill. If what has been done heretofore has not quieted the people of Dearborn county, shall we not act now, and still endeavor to produce so desirable a result? The people had petitioned for relief, and they had a right to be heard. Legislators are but agents of the people, and should carry into effect their wishes, provided the constitution did not prohibit it. The amendments now made to the bill left it without constitutional objection, and on the belief that the passage of it would quiet existing difficulties and allay excitement, he would vote for this bill. The members of the House of Representatives from Dearborn county, who were ex amined under oath, testified before the committee, that, in their opinion, the adoption of tnis measure would allay the unfortunate excitement which has for some years pervaded the county of lCrtlUUIU. 11 YJ DIOVCU UCIUIL HJL committee that the members of the House of Representatives were elected with express reference to the division of the county, showing conclusively that a majority of the people were in favor of the division. Mr. Colerick said he would cheerful ly go for the bill, if it were not for the facts staring him in the face, that there is no surplus territory belonging to Dearborn county. Such evidence, he said, was furnished by the certificate of the Surveyor General. Mr. Mitchell said he felt all the sympathy and respect for the petitioners for this new county that any gentleman could feel, but it was the duty of memhers to dismiss their personal feelings and consider the question on its merits, Has Dearborn county an amount ol territory over 400 square miles? The Senate has evidence conclusive to his mind, evidence sufficient to hang a man on a criminal prosecution, that there is no surplus. 1 he certificate of the Surveyor-General, whose opportunities tor information on this subject were superior to those of any other individual, was conclusive. He spoke at some, length of the inexpediency and injuriOiis effects of this measure. Pass this bill, said he, and who can tell how many similar applications will be made.

Many counties in the state have an a- face, and shall we yet proceed? Ihe local pauy mi ues w.n, wuu moie man i,y two acts, thai which we would remount of territory exceeding the con- senator from Lawrence has among oth- ordinary force, disturb the quiet of old volt at doing by one? Or can we jusslilutional amount: and by the passage er things said that in construing the Dearborn. (ify our lending ourselves the willing of this bill, the temptation is held out to constitution, we should observe its The bill is ushered in here under instruments of fraud and corruption, to

all of them to do as Dearborn county proposes to do. lie expressed his decided opposition to interfering with and unsettling county boundaries and county seats. It had been said by one gentleman that if any member of the House of Representatives would, under oath, slate that there was a surplus of territory, he would support the bill,

He differed from that gentleman. He formation of new ones should not be re- would not wish any ot them to be dtions generally are, lo tne reiici wmcii would not vote for it if five hundred duced. The spirit of this provision U sworn: they are all men of honor and is granted by the legislature. es,sir, men were to swear lo it, because the to prevent frequent divisions, to keep worth. They are such men as any they are as the yankecs would say, Surveyor General's opinion was the down ambitious aspirants for office and county might well be proud of. Their "within a squirrel's jump" of the mark, best authority that could be adduced.,, wealth, who might arise, and from in- word is enough for me in all cases A territory is prayed to be formed into Mr Milroy made some remarks a- tcrested motives disturb the public where their better judgment is not a countv, that is something like from gainst the bill, which he believed both tranquility. Though 1 differ from the warped by interest or party excite- twelve to twenty m. es in length, and unconstitutional an inexpedient. senator from Lawrence, that those only mer.t. In this case, politically, the the rerponse is by this bill, lorming a Mr. Colerick aid he had became so are to be considered old counties, that Senator alone weighs as much as all connly about four miles square. It is far satisfied in regard to the provisions were formed before the formation of the the representatives. He alone, is near enough, says ihe gentleman Irom of the bill as to vote against postpone- constitution, all are old in reference to Dearborn county in the Senate. '1 hey, Lawrence aye, it is mathematical prement, and probably, for the bill. On the newly created counties at any time, altogether, are Dearborn county in the cision. It is as near as two canUiaales

investigation of the bill, Ic found that if there should be found to be no surplus, the bill will not take effect. The debate was further continued by Messrs. Thompson of L., Mitchell, Dunning, Dumont-and Walker, whose remarks may be published in our next. The question was then t.iken on the indefinite postponement of the bill, and determined in the affirmative by the following vote: Yeas Messrs. Beard, Bell, Boon, Chambers, Clark, Con well, Daily, Dobson, Dumont, Dunning, Elliott, Hamilton, Liston, Little, Milrov, Mitchell, Plummer, Sigler, Smitii, Stanford, Thompson of P., Thompson of J., Vawter, and Walker 24.

N AVS--Messrs. Bradv, Casey, Claypool, Colerick, Collins, Crawford. Everts. Ewing, Fowler, Hackett, Hillis, Hoagland, Kennedy, Moore, Morgan, Puett, Stafford, Stewart, Turman, i hompson of L., and Trask 22. REMARKS OF MR. DU3IONT, In the Senate, Jan. 9th, on the indefinite postponement of the bill a erect a new county out of the county of Dearborn. Mr. DUMONT said Mr. President: Being a member of the judiciary committee to which this bill has been twice referred, and now reported back against my approbation, lt may be expected of me tc express my views on this subject. There is not now time to view the whole ground, the shades of night are closing round us. This whole day has been spent on this motion the merits of the bill have been fully discussed on former days and the Senate are impatient for taking the vote; I will therefore hastily and hurried as it necessarily must be, nolice some few things that have escaped the notice of others who have taken part in the discussion. I am sorry that one Senator should have been deseri-

bed as an animal between two ricks of days at each session, if the business rehay. The same perhaps might be said quires it. And you, Mr. President,

of some others. The Senator from

Lawrence objects to the amendment as that rich county does require it. You imperfect, and highly objectionable, have practised law there, as well as myand yet he wishes the passage of the self, and never has one week been suf-

(itl. I nrlrr.it iJr- ;,..iiph,mii f h!ficient o transact (he hnsineps of the

amendment but it is far more perfect , , norn.mmnnJJ k I m rnm. mittee. This modification I had the lllflll UtlkILtV;iIlllltllUl.U UT II1UI.VIIIhonor to submit this morning, and it was adopted by the Senate. It was the best that could be engrafted on so imperfect a bill. Still it is imperfect, and so grossly imperfect, as to be near Ivor quite a nullity. The amendment for which this is a substitute, and also this amendment, are designed to render the bill constitutional by procuring ;l survey, to ascertain whether there will be an excess over 400 square miles, I say the proviso is void. I ask the senator from Allen, the senator from Lawrence, and all the members of the judiciary committee, whether this savine this proviso is not void? It is the law of the land that a saving re.nupmant J i - ----- ........ - - n f Q ho the body of the statute is void. No lawyer will deny that this is the rule of construction. Our courts will be bound bv it. and the proviso is nugalory. The body of the bill establishes and organizes the county, and the proI viso contemplates a survey, and de dares that ilshall not be a county unless there are 400 square miles m Dearborn county, exclusive of the contemplated county. The bill, as it is, organizes a county the saving is repuguant and void. The constitutional objections are not obviated vve have I yet the constitution staring us in the spirit. So we should. We have the happiness to have the presence ot the senator from Carrol', one of the framers of the constitution. From him we learn what we may well imagine from the letter of the constitution. The convention intended to prevent the format ion of small counties, to fix a minimum below which old counties in the

But suppose he iscorrect, his argument is against his position. Dearborn is an old county. It was anold county when the constitution was adopted and to reduce her below 400 square miles would be esteemed by ail a violation of our charter. But there is another constitutional giound upon which this bill infringes. By the 20th section of the 3d article of the constitution, it is provided as follows: '-Nor shall any member of either branch of the General Assembly during the lime or which he is elected, be eligible to any office, the appointment of which is vested in the General Assembly." I believe the gentlemen of i . i i. ii i . t

Hum i snail speaK or some oi mem are now in our lobby, but that will not pre clude me from xpressing fully and (reely my objections. It is provided by this bill that William Watt, Henry P. Thornton, and Marks Crume, shall be appointed commissioners to locate the county scat in the county of Ohio. Had 1 any business of importance to transact, I would as soon entrust it to those gentlemen as to any others of my acquaintance. But who arc they? i hey arc members of this General As sembly!! Representatives in the olher branch of the legislature! Who now does not perceive that this bill is unconstitutional, by appointing those men, or either of them, to be cummissionersto locate tins contemplated com ty seal? Were my own name inserted. 1 would not vote for the bill if that were the only objection. This bill creates the office of commissioners, and at the same time vests their appointment in the General Assembly, and takes mem bers of the General Assembly to (ill those offices!! But this is not its least absurdity. By an act that passed both Houses a few day.- since, the circuit courts are to commence in the county of Dearborn on the fourth Mondays of April and Uclober,and are to sit twelve well know that the great business ol courts; nearly the whole of two week ' ' ----- - . . . - . 13S MVP mnSllmPI 111 )( l,".1l--born courts and notwithstanding this, this bill so perfect, as it is nlledged to be, having received the finishing polish f a double session of the judiciary committee this bill provides that the 1 courts in the county ol (Jhio, shall sit on the first Mondays of May and No vemuer, and sit six days it the business require it. 1 his bill, which (to take the words of its advocates) is to put an ctul to the anarchy of Dearborn, to restore order, by the establishing courts ' justice, to protect the lives and the property of the citizens and ensure the collection of debts, provides for a court to it w hen another court in the same circuit will be in session! To adminisHer justice without a judge! Here will i - - be order, indeed, growing up out oi tne midst ol contusion ; or rattier confusion out of pretended order. The J senator from Floyd has adverted to the appropriate character given to the senator from Jennings, by the Phrenolo1 gist, that ne was a pence JHoArer, and that by opposing this bill, he would lose that amiable character. L.et gentlcmen look to it, whether they are not themselves sowing the seeds of lasting discord by their support of this bill. It it becomes a law, the conten Hion will increase things now settled, will be shaken to their foundations, and the high auspices ot a legislative tarce. It is urged on mis noor, mat tne ioui representatives of Dearborn county were sworn on the committee, and that the senator was not on oath, and tnougn the representatives and senator differed in their statements, yet as the re prescntatives were sworn, they are entitled to the greatest weight and credit. 1

V11K EV.--A. SG7.

House of Rcpresntatives and no more. They, on their oalh, stated that they believed it to be the wish of Dearborn county, that the county of Ohio should b stricken offand organized. Ho, on bis honor, said the contrary. Every member oi'tlie legislature is on his oath on committee or" in the Hall, and a double swearing can give no more credence to the statements that cither may make. I will notice part of (he evidence of Mr. James. lie said that that the election turned upon the question of a division of the countv, and that the four candidates in favor ofa division were elected. Uutthe members of the committee well know that in answer to a question propounded by myself, iie admitted (and 1 ikc mm the better for the admission" that a division proposing such a boun dary for the new county as the present contemplated county of Ohio, was not lgitaled among the people, that the question was "-division' or "no division." This evidence then nrnvps noth. ing. No election test iv.n ever ha A in Dearborn county on the question beore us. Ibis new county, four miles square, never entered the imagination of the citizens of Dearborn" Mr. James further admitted on his oath. that if this bill passes, the present county scat of Dearborn will be changed, but (hat it would be changed any how. W hether these results are c.ertain to take place, or are only conjec ture in the witness, they prove that the formation of this new county will not settle all the difficulties in old Dear born. Things will vet be afloat, and we have all the w ide, w ild field of con jecture as to when the troubles will cease. Mr. James on being asked whether in his belief the people of the new county would hereafter wish to enlarge their county boundaries, answer ed that "they would to the extent of their petition." This is a mere trifle only seven times as great an amount, as what is proposed by this bill. Mr. James further stated that "they were without a court to collect their debts." This we know has been the case, but the Supreme Court, within a few days, has declared Wilmington to be the lawful county seat of Dearborn co. and there the courts will regularly sit hereafter. So that the evil that did once exist for want of justice, no longer exists. This is an extraordinary and unprecedented concern. A county with seventeen square miles! Not the half ofa single township! And do you believe that this is in good faith, to be and remain such a countv if we make it uch? No, sir; the arguments of gen tlemen admit an intended extension of its borders; the evidence of Mr. James admits it. What, then, is the position in which we are placed? We are to be the willing instruments to carry on a f,;Uid. (0 (,e We are to lend our assistance next legislature to violate the constitution. We are to say "we did not do it, we left old Dearborn with 4qo square miles." And the next Legislature are to say 'we did not do it; we were not forming anew county; we were only adding to an old one." We will be like the two thieves in the butcher's stall, one of whom stole a piece of beef, and handed it to his fel ovv to put under his cloak. On being charged by the butcher with the theft, the one who took it, swore he had not the beef; and the one who had it under - i,js cln;,k, swore he did not take it. Is h,-,s ti1(, way (,.,t gentlemen are to ev,,de their oaths? Is it righteous to do some luture legislature, I say mere is not one petitioner ior un: cuumy ui Ohio not one. The petitioners are for a county with the boundaries that would contain nearly seven times as much territory. But the senator trom Lawrence says that we snouiu noi oe very particular about the petitions, That these petitions areas near as pe-